\n<\/p>\n
Dannah Gresh:<\/span> What do you tell your kids when their classmates hurt them? Here\u2019s Emily Jensen.\u00a0<\/p>\n Emily Jensen:<\/span> Their identity does not<\/em> come from who they say they are. It doesn’t come from who someone else says they are. It comes from who God says that they are. And because of that, they don’t have to receive\u2014and they shouldn’t receive\u2014everything that everyone says to them or about them.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>This is the Revive Our Hearts <\/em>podcast with Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth, author of Choosing Gratitude<\/em>, for August 17, 2026. I\u2019m Dannah Gresh.<\/p>\n This month on Revive Our Hearts, <\/em>we\u2019re looking at all the different seasons of a woman\u2019s life. And this week we\u2019re zeroing in on those parenting what you might call \u201cbig kids.\u201d It\u2019s for the moms who have weathered the little years, and they\u2019re entering new seas: the elementary years, the tween years, the teen years. And yes, we need wisdom for all of it!<\/p>\n A big part of those years is school. Are you curious how the gospel applies to the back-to-school season? Then you\u2019ve come to the right place! We\u2019ve got Emily Jensen with us today, and she\u2019s thought deeply about this topic.\u00a0<\/p>\n She\u2019s mom to five, which I think means she\u2019s packed a lot of lunches in her day. On top of this, she\u2019s co-author of the books Risen Motherhood<\/em><\/a> and Gospel Mom<\/em><\/a>, so she loves applying the gospel to motherhood and family life. Hello, Emily Jensen, and welcome back to Revive Our Hearts!<\/em><\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Wow, thanks for having me! It’s always so fun to be here.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>It is always fun to have you. As we wind down the summer, tell me, what two emotional words come to mind, as a mom?<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Two emotional words . . . I would say, \u201crelief.\u201d (laughter) I should just say, I always anticipate and enjoy a transitional season. So I look forward to summer at the end of spring. But I\u2019m always looking forward to fall at the end of summer, because it brings a whole new group of fun things that we get to do as a family. It also lets us leave behind some of the things that maybe we were getting a little fatigued and tired about.\u00a0<\/p>\n I can\u2019t think of an exact second word except maybe a little bittersweet sadness, because every summer that goes by, my kids get a little bit older. It feels like the years are going faster and faster and the summers are going faster and faster! And so, I just see that counting down. There is that little bittersweet pang in my heart as I see another summer behind us.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>How old is your oldest?<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>My oldest is going into eighth grade. I have twins going into seventh grade. I have a fifth grader and a fourth grader.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Wow! I didn\u2019t know you have twins. That is awesome!<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Yes, twin boys.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Twin boys\u2014how old are the twin boys?\u00a0<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>They are twelve.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>I have seven-year-old twin granddaughters, so we have walked the twin road. It is a blast . . . but a blur!\u00a0<\/p>\n So, let\u2019s talk about how the gospel intersects with being a mom in those crazy busy mom years and those seasons of stops and starts. Let\u2019s start with this: first of all, the gospel is all about Jesus. Tell me why you love Him so much.<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Oh, I love Jesus so much because of the new life that He\u2019s given me! I think sometimes we think about the things that we get to leave behind whenever we come to Christ, but I also love thinking about the things that I\u2019ve been invited into!<\/p>\n And not only is that for this life, but there is so much that now I\u2019m invited into eternally. So even day in and day out, just the peace that I get to experience because of Jesus in my heart, that no matter what I face, no matter how hard my day is, no matter how frustrated I am with parenting, no matter what happens; I can say, \u201cIt is well with my soul.\u201d\u00a0<\/p>\n I can do that in part because I know that someday every tear is going to be wiped away. All of that work is going to be worth it. I\u2019m going to be with Him forever and see the tremendous fruit of what He was doing in and through His Church! I just love, love, love being a part of that!<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>As you look back at understanding the eternity of salvation and all of that, do you have a time you remember when you really understood it and locked into it and surrendered your heart to Him? Take us to that day.<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Yes, so this would have been after my sophomore year of college. I was twenty years old. Even though I had grown up calling myself a Christian and going to church with my family and going to youth group, I was not actually following the Lord.vI had not really surrendered my life to Him. I had not really truly understood the gospel of Jesus Christ.\u00a0<\/p>\n As a result of that, I was living in pretty intense disobedience. I was just kind of doing whatever I wanted. I was doing the typical college girl thing, and God kept taking stuff away from me\u2014which I\u2019m so thankful for! He just kept showing me that every road I went down that wasn\u2019t His was just ending in disappointment and destruction.<\/strong> And so after the end of a relationship that I had put a lot of my hope in, I was kind of at just a rock bottom, emotionally.<\/p>\n For the first time ever, I really cried out to God for help. It was not just, \u201cHelp God, because I\u2019ve made a mess of this situation and I want You to clean it up and make it right for me,\u201d but, \u201cHelp, because I have no hope in my life without You. This isn\u2019t a life without You.\u201d<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Yes.<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>I didn\u2019t even have fancy words to pray. I literally think I prayed, \u201cHelp me, God!\u201d\u00a0<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>I think that sometimes it is the most theologically rich prayer you can pray!\u00a0<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>And He did; He helped me! That was back in the day, twenty years ago. That week I was actually in a Barnes and Noble. <\/em>I had never been in the Christian book section before, but for some reason I went there.<\/p>\n A book jumped out at me off the shelf. I grabbed it, and I went to my local coffee shop, and I started reading . . . and the gospel was in that book! The Lord, for the very first time, really allowed me to understand it and to receive it and to put my hope and trust in Christ.<\/p>\n That was twenty years ago, and I felt like it was just night and day, you know. The Word of God came alive to me, the joy of walking with God came alive to me, and just the purpose of a life found in Christ.<\/strong><\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>I love that! You know, I was in a bookstore\u2014it was a little tiny hole-in-the-wall bookstore\u2014in my twenties. I was a believer. I was surrendered. But I was dry, and I needed to be revived.\u00a0<\/p>\n I walked into a bookstore, saw a book on prayer and picked it up. I went to the Lions\u2019 Club park next door, and it totally revolutionized my life to start praying! It wasn\u2019t like I wasn\u2019t praying before; it was just that it was different. So, I don\u2019t know, maybe the moral of our story is: get a good Christian book and dive in! It might be a game-changer for you!\u00a0<\/p>\n Okay, so you saw the gospel for the first time in this book, you understood it for the first time as you read. The word \u201cgospel,\u201d I think that we over-use it sometimes. Am I the only one that thinks that? Maybe I am. I feel like I might be the black sheep of the family for even saying that, but what would you say when I say that we can overuse that term?<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>I think you\u2019re right. That\u2019s the trouble with good terms. They can gain traction, and we start to use them, but then we start using them so much that they lose their meaning. I think that in the church I\u2019ve seen the gospel used in two primary ways.\u00a0<\/p>\n One is to describe the immediate good news of salvation, that Jesus came. He\u2019s fully God and fully man. He lived a perfect life on our behalf, and He died on the cross for sinners. Then, if we put our hope and trust in Him and we turn from our sin, we are saved. We get eternal life with Him in heaven. That is the gospel!<\/p>\n And I think that is probably what a lot of people mean when they say, \u201cOh, you need the gospel! You need to hear the gospel to be saved.\u201d Absolutely! That is absolutely 100 percent true. That is the good news.<\/p>\n But then, there is another way that we can use the word \u201cgospel,\u201d the \u201cgood news,\u201d that encompasses the whole story of Scripture from Genesis to Revelation. This is the big story that God is writing for His people.<\/p>\n And that word is, a lot of times, what I\u2019m thinking about now when I\u2019m going, \u201cHow does the gospel change my life?\u201d Absolutely, the life, death and resurrection of Jesus changes my life, but I\u2019m fitting that within the even bigger story that is good news for those who have put their hope and faith in Christ.<\/p>\n So, those are kind of two different ways I think about it. I do have to try to be more precise sometimes when I\u2019m saying, \u201cOh, I have hope in the gospel.\u201d Well, what does that mean? We do have to kind of stop and think about it.\u00a0<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Yes. Stop and think about it and never forget to personalize it. I think that\u2019s my beef. I love the gospel. I think the Word gives us language like \u201credemption\u201d and \u201csanctification,\u201d and all that.<\/p>\n But also, we have to remember, to a lost world, that word doesn\u2019t have a lot of meaning; it\u2019s just a theological term. And so, we have to introduce them to the person of Jesus and the life change that He can bring. So that\u2019s why I love what you just said there as you described the two components of that.<\/p>\n So, how do you live that out on the hot pavement of life, as a mom? Fast forward: you\u2019re not that twenty-years-ago girl who was just like, \u201cLet me figure this out. My life doesn\u2019t have any hope without You.\u201d You are a mom of many. What does going back to school look like because of the gospel?<\/strong><\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Back to school because of the gospel . . . Well, I think that there are four words that tend to help me anchor my thinking about the gospel and then apply it to my life, so I\u2019ll share those really quickly.\u00a0<\/p>\n They are: creation, fall, redemption, and consummation. I\u2019ll explain what those are so you don\u2019t need to write them down or anything. I tend to think in those categories whenever I\u2019m trying to process something in my life through the lens of the gospel.<\/p>\n So when I think, Okay, my kids are going to go back to school,<\/em> one of the things that always comes to my mind is that they are made in His image. God created them; they belong to Him. I want them to grow in wisdom and in knowledge.<\/p>\n That\u2019s part of God\u2019s good design for our lives as people, that we would gain knowledge about all kinds of things\u2014about how the world that God made works, about social situations, about how do we live in good friendships, about how do we respect teachers? So that is a good thing, fundamentally, whether you\u2019re doing school at home or you\u2019re in private school, whatever your schooling choice is. There is goodness in your kid doing that work!<\/p>\n So I think about the Fall<\/strong>, and I think about the fact that nothing is quite as it should be. In fact, things are often deeply challenging, deeply broken. There is no perfect system, there\u2019s no perfect solution. Everything has challenges.<\/strong><\/p>\n And so, even as we look ahead to the school year, I do start sometimes thinking about the challenges. Whether that\u2019s financial struggles that someone might be facing or worried about as the school year starts\u2014the school supply list, the sign-up fees that come in.<\/p>\n Or there may be a teacher that you\u2019re like, \u201cOh, I was not really excited that they got that teacher!\u201d or \u201cI\u2019m not really sure how we\u2019re going to work through those things,\u201d or there\u2019s a friend in the class that they\u2019re interacting with regularly that you\u2019re not excited about.\u00a0<\/p>\n Those things are real, and we need to acknowledge that that\u2019s part of life, instead of always saying, \u201cOkay, what about this?\u201d It\u2019s going to be hard and broken. And then, that redemption piece is thinking about, How does the hope that I have in Christ intersect this challenge? How does this good thing that He\u2019s given me<\/em>transform it or change the way I live in the midst of it?<\/em><\/p>\n Because any situation that we find ourselves in, any circumstance we find ourselves in, we want to be approaching that like a Christian\u2014with Christ-like qualities, with the fruit of the Spirit.<\/p>\n So whatever the challenge is about school, \u201cI\u2019m going to do that with love. I\u2019m going to do it with joy. I\u2019m going to do it with patience. I\u2019m going to do it with peace. I want to do it in a way that is trying to be a witness.\u201d<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Yep.<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>And then, in all of that, no matter how things turn out (there are going to be good days and bad days) I am thinking, This isn\u2019t forever!<\/em> This is the season that God has me in right now. I can be faithful in it, but it doesn\u2019t have to all get perfectly resolved this side of heaven if I\u2019m putting my hope and trust in Him.<\/p>\n So that sounds very existential, but I do think about situations and transitions in life through that lens of all of those different pieces\u2014trying to hold them together, even for something like the transition back to school.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Well, I think you\u2019ve described the four big themes\u2014or the metanarratives\u2014of Scripture. If we could understand those things, then it is going to help us on the hot pavement of life. It\u2019s not just eternity in Heaven, but it\u2019s the here and now, the abundant life.<\/p>\n So I\u2019m thinking of the second and third. You talked about the Fall, the sinfulness of this world we live in, and then Redemption. I feel like for us to experience the redemption in something we have to see the fallenness of something. So let\u2019s apply that to a few things that we\u2019re going to face in back-to-school month.<\/p>\n Let\u2019s start with \u201cFrenemies.\u201d (laughter) I feel like at my True Girlministry, one of the big emails and DMs I get from moms in August and September are \u201cmean girl moments\u201d\u2014this girl that has been a bully to my daughter is in her class, or whatever.<\/p>\n So let\u2019s look at that in terms of the Fall and redemption. What would you say to a mom who writes to you and says, \u201cMy daughter has a frenemy. What do I do?\u201d<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Ugh, that is so hard! Why?! Why are girls like this?!<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Why are we?\u00a0<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Basically, the Fall. It\u2019s because of the Fall!<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Yep.<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>I think obviously it depends a lot on the situation involved. But assuming this is maybe the other girl that is doing the majority of the bullying and the provoking. I think one thing is just explaining to kids where that comes from.<\/p>\n One of the things we learn in the book of James is that a lot of times, quarrels and fights, bullying and insecurity, things like that, arise from the selfish ambition that is inside of us. It arises from the wounds in our hearts, the insecurity in our hearts. It arises from a prideful, selfish place.<\/p>\n So I think helping your own child see hate, honestly, is not even about you. It\u2019s about her brokenness, and it\u2019s about her desire to be loved, and it\u2019s about her selfish ambition and wanting to find a way to feel good and safe and happy with her life. I think that can kind of help to de-personalize it a little bit.\u00a0<\/p>\n And then I think also just recognizing and helping your child understand what you can control and what you can\u2019t control<\/strong> and what Jesus says about loving and walking alongside our enemies. He actually says to pray for our enemies.<\/p>\n He actually says that we should not put ourselves over and over again in horrible situations. Certainly, we can have boundaries, but there is to be a spirit of forbearance and kindness and prayer towards them.<\/strong><\/p>\n So I would really encourage, \u201cLet\u2019s pray for her!\u201d Let\u2019s pray for her, because if she is this mean and this bullying and she is really lashing out at you, she is probably hurting, and she needs Jesus, and we ought to pray for her! I even think that helps to change a heart posture.<\/p>\n And then the third thing that came to mind is just really instilling in our own kids their identity in Christ. Their identity does <\/strong>not<\/em><\/strong> come from who they say they are. It doesn’t come from who someone else says they are. It comes from who God says that they are. Because of that, they don’t have to receive\u2014and they shouldn’t receive\u2014everything that everyone says to them or about them<\/strong>. In fact, there are a lot of things that are not true about you that you just need to kind of tune out and turn away from, because that\u2019s not what God says about you in His Word.<\/p>\n You need to build your thoughts about yourself and your worth and your purpose in what the Bible says about you and, honestly, surround yourself with people who are pointing you to that as well.<\/p>\n That\u2019s, of course, where parents come in. They need to say, \u201cYou know, there are times where our children are not able to fully protect themselves, to fully advocate for themselves.\u201d They need us in positions of authority and care in their lives to step in sometimes and to help navigate things or help them gravitate toward healthier friendships. We can actually talk through scripts of, \u201cWhat would you say when she says this? How can you respond in this situation if she comes and sits at your lunch table?\u201d<\/p>\n Sometimes you have to get that granular. I think that\u2019s one of things I\u2019ve learned as I\u2019ve gotten older and am overcoming my sin. I\u2019ll say, \u201cOkay, I want to grow in this situation.\u201d I\u2019ll actually be really granular and tangible and specific in all kinds of different things.<\/p>\n It\u2019s not just, \u201cI\u2019m just going to pray and it will go away.\u201d There are actual, practical strategies that we need to drive. Our kids need those practical strategies to live in a sinful world. We as parents have to come alongside them and try to equip them with that.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>So, there\u2019s a lot there because unfortunately we live in a sinful world.<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>We do. You mentioned identity. I think that\u2019s a really important term. That takes us back to that first metatheme of creation. We were created, Genesis 1 says, as image-bearers of God\u2014female image-bearers and male image-bearers of God.\u00a0<\/p>\n He did not make a mistake when He made us male and female.<\/strong> There was intention and precision in that design, but the identity issue is one that all of our kids are going to face, no matter their school type.<\/strong><\/p>\n They are going to hear it in the world; they are going to hear it in the news; they are going to see it in their neighborhood. What challenges have your children faced in the area of having questions about identity or gender, and how have you responded to them?<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Yes. I\u2019m grateful that we started young with giving them a theology of gender, giving them a theology of identity early on. I can even remember taking them to the public library\u2014knowing what month it was, or what kind of books were going to be out. Being prepared and kind of provoking a little bit of that. I want them to ask this question because I want to get a chance to answer it, and I want to get a chance to point these things out.\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n So I think that for us, it\u2019s been a lot of small conversations over and over and over again, in a lot of different contexts over a long period of time.<\/strong><\/p>\n And so for us, what we\u2019ve seen is that our kids have a pretty strongly formed view: \u201cI\u2019m thankful for being an image-bearer, and for being a boy or a girl.\u201d We\u2019ve had to actually teach them compassion and a sense of heartbrokenness and kindness towards people who don\u2019t have that worldview, because kids can be very black-and-white.<\/strong><\/p>\n And you recognize that just as fast as you\u2019ve taught them. \u201cOh, God\u2019s design for the world is the way it should be, and it\u2019s so good. We have to stand firm.\u201d I probably hammered that in so hard. Now sometimes when they see someone who is different or struggling, the first word out of their mouth is something that\u2019s just a little bit like, \u201cUuh!\u201d We\u2019re really working on, “Wait a second, this is also an image-bearer. Are they sad? Are they struggling apart from the Lord? We don\u2019t know. Can we pray for them?\u201d\u00a0<\/p>\n And so, that\u2019s something we\u2019re really working through as we\u2019re forming identity. Things like: \u201cWell, what types of things shape people\u2019s identity and their view of themselves?\u201d and \u201cYou guys have grown up in a family who\u2019s tried to give you a strong identity, but some people are coming from very hurt backgrounds, very lonely backgrounds. No one has told them that God made them. No one has told them that God loves them.\u201d So we\u2019re trying to work through some of those things, especially in a middle school context.\u00a0<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Yes, I love that! I love that you said, \u201cStart early.\u201d So, we\u2019re talking to you about how we pour the gospel into our kids. I\u2019d love it if you’d come back tomorrow and talk about how we pour it into or receive it into our own hearts when we\u2019re overwhelmed, when our kids forget their lunchbox for the 500th time this week, when we are like, \u201cOkay, everybody\u2019s getting whatever\u2019s at school!\u201d Or, my plans for Bible study and a quiet week alone or with girlfriends are coming to an end. How do we pour the gospel into our own hearts and lives as moms? Will you come back tomorrow and talk about that?<\/p>\n Emily: <\/span>Oh yeah, let’s get into it!<\/p>\n Dannah: <\/span>Wonderful, I can\u2019t wait!\u00a0<\/p>\n In the meantime, I want to point you to some super helpful resources for your kids as they navigate life in a fallen world. First, Lies Girls Believe<\/em><\/a>\u2014a book written by me, actually!\u00a0<\/p>\n In a world that lies about identity, friendship, boys, and so much more, this resource teaches your girl to look for truth in God\u2019s Word. Ideal for girls ages 8\u201312, this study will give you the tools you need to start important conversations at an age-appropriate pace.\u00a0<\/p>\n We\u2019ve also got Lies Boys Believe<\/em><\/a>, written by Erin and Jason Davis. And let me tell you, there\u2019s no couple better equipped to write that book! They\u2019ve got a whole crew of boys in their house, and Erin and Jason have been raising them well.\u00a0<\/p>\n In the book, they cover lies like: \u201cLoving God is for girls,\u201d \u201cGod is mad at me,\u201d \u201cNo one needs to know about my sin,\u201d \u201cIt doesn\u2019t matter what I watch,\u201d and so much more. It\u2019s a very helpful resource!<\/p>\n And last but not least, Lies Young Women Believe<\/em><\/a>. I co-wrote this one with my dear friend, Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth. It\u2019s for the young women in your family\u2014those nearing adulthood and navigating some heavier questions.<\/p>\n Maybe you need one! Maybe you need two! Maybe you need all three of these books! Whatever the case, you\u2019ll find these titles at links in the transcript of today\u2019s program at ReviveOurHearts.com<\/a>. I hope you\u2019ll take advantage of these Bible-saturated resources as you shepherd your kids this school year.<\/p>\n As seasons change, we want to meet you with unchanging hope. Finding Beauty in Every Season <\/em>is a book designed to help you see goodness right where you are. You\u2019ll explore beautiful photography from our team along with daily quotes from Nancy\u2019s teaching.\u00a0<\/p>\n This new resource is yours when you make a donation <\/a>of any amount to Revive Our Hearts <\/em>this month. To give and request your copy, visit\u00a0ReviveourHearts.com<\/a>, or call us at 1-800-569-5959.\u00a0<\/p>\n Well, as you just heard, we are back with Emily Jensen tomorrow to talk about how moms live in light of the gospel. What do you do when your day flies off the rails? How do you share the gospel with your kids? What does it look like to maintain a healthy marriage as parents? We\u2019re exploring all this and more. Please be back for Revive Our Hearts<\/em>.<\/p>\n This program is a listener-supported production of Revive Our Hearts<\/em> in Niles, Michigan, calling women to freedom, fullness, and fruitfulness in Christ.<\/p>\n \n *Offers available only during the broadcast of the podcast season.<\/em><\/small><\/p>\n<\/p><\/div>\n