{"id":187426,"date":"2025-04-16T05:56:13","date_gmt":"2025-04-16T05:56:13","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/peraltafinancing.com\/business\/marketing\/the-challenges-facing-marketing-leaders\/"},"modified":"2025-04-16T05:56:13","modified_gmt":"2025-04-16T05:56:13","slug":"the-challenges-facing-marketing-leaders","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/fivemor.com\/?p=187426","title":{"rendered":"The Challenges Facing Marketing Leaders"},"content":{"rendered":"<p> <br \/>\n<\/p>\n<div data-bglz=\"1\" itemprop=\"text\">\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/emmaplogan\/\" class=\"external\" target=\"_blank\">Emma Logan<\/a> is the founder and chief connections officer of the <a href=\"https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/company\/the-emma-logan-project\/\" class=\"external\" target=\"_blank\">Emma Logan Project,<\/a> which helps marketers stop blending in and start standing out. Emma has spent the past 14 years as an insider to the upper echelons of marketing and media leadership, holding senior roles in Australia, the UK, and New Zealand.\u00a0<\/p>\n<p>While there has never been a more exciting time to be a marketer, it is also one of the most challenging. Rapidly changing technology, fragmented media channels, and increased demands for accountability are impacting senior marketers. Operating under these more challenging employment conditions and often unrealistic expectations, many marketers are choosing to stay safe, which is influencing behaviour. Emma discusses the challenges marketing leaders face and how they adapt to this changing environment.<\/p>\n<p>You can listen to the podcast here:<\/p>\n<p><iframe data-bglz=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/www.trinityp3.com\/podcasts\/challenges-facing-marketing-leaders\/about:blank\" width=\"100%\" height=\"166\" frameborder=\"no\" scrolling=\"no\" data-rocket-lazyload=\"fitvidscompatible\" data-lazy-src=\"https:\/\/w.soundcloud.com\/player\/?url=https%3A\/\/api.soundcloud.com\/tracks\/2073524508&amp;color=%23ff5500&amp;auto_play=false&amp;hide_related=false&amp;show_comments=true&amp;show_user=true&amp;show_reposts=false&amp;show_teaser=true\"><\/iframe><noscript><iframe loading=\"lazy\" data-bglz=\"1\" src=\"https:\/\/w.soundcloud.com\/player\/?url=https%3A\/\/api.soundcloud.com\/tracks\/2073524508&amp;color=%23ff5500&amp;auto_play=false&amp;hide_related=false&amp;show_comments=true&amp;show_user=true&amp;show_reposts=false&amp;show_teaser=true\" width=\"100%\" height=\"166\" frameborder=\"no\" scrolling=\"no\"><\/iframe><\/noscript><\/p>\n<p>Follow Managing Marketing on\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/soundcloud.com\/managing-marketing\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Soundcloud<\/a>,\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/managingmarketing.podbean.com\/\" rel=\"noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Podbean,<\/a>\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/tunein.com\/podcasts\/Business--Economics-Podcasts\/Managing-Marketing-p1275737\/\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">TuneIn<\/a>,\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/75mJ4Gt6MWzFWvmd3A64XW\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Stitcher,<\/a>\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/75mJ4Gt6MWzFWvmd3A64XW\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Spotify,<\/a>\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/au\/podcast\/managing-marketing\/id1018735190\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Apple Podcast<\/a>\u00a0and\u00a0<a class=\"external\" href=\"https:\/\/music.amazon.com\/podcasts\/5e7b205c-81c9-44e0-aa1d-d2ce504c6048%E2%80%8B\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" target=\"_blank\">Amazon Podcasts.<\/a><\/p>\n<h3\/>\n<h3 style=\"text-align: center;\">I think there\u2019s a big opportunity. I think marketing, as we were saying, is going through a huge transition moment at the moment. And there\u2019s a big opportunity for leaders to step up to have that voice.<\/h3>\n<h3\/>\n<h3>Transcription:<\/h3>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Hi, I\u2019m Darren Woolley, Founder and CEO of TrinityP3 Marketing Management Consultancy. And welcome to Managing Marketing, a weekly podcast where we discuss the issues and opportunities facing marketing, media, and advertising with industry thought leaders and practitioners.<\/p>\n<p>If you enjoy the Managing Marketing Podcast, please either like, review, or share this episode to spread the words and wisdom of our guests each week.<\/p>\n<p>There has never been a more exciting time to be a marketer, but it\u2019s also one of the most challenging. Rapidly changing technology, fragmented media channels and increased demands for accountability is impacting senior marketers. Operating under these tougher employment conditions and often, unrealistic expectations, many marketers are choosing to stay safe, which is impacting behavior.<\/p>\n<p>My guest today spent the past 14 years as an insider to the upper echelon of marketing and media leadership, holding senior roles in Australia, the UK, and New Zealand. She\u2019s now launched her own business to help marketers stop blending in and start standing out.<\/p>\n<p>Please welcome to the Managing Marketing Podcast, the Founder and Chief Connections Officer of The Emma Logan Project, Emma Logan. Welcome, Emma.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Hi, Darren. So gorgeous to be here.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Well, look, thank you. And I have to say I love the name, The Emma Logan Project because it is trading off a reputation you have built for really connecting and understanding the challenges that marketers are feeling, particularly senior marketers.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. And as you know, a good name has a story behind it. And you would know from when you started your business 25 years ago, creating the name of a business is actually one of the hardest things to do.<\/p>\n<p>Naturally, I went back and forth, and the story behind my name actually came really personally to me, that when I stepped down from a role and I was working through what was next, every time I spoke with my father, he said to me, \u201cHow\u2019s The Emma Logan Project going?\u201d And he actually related it to me and my journey and what I was up to, and how I was. And so, when it came time, I was like has it been sitting in front of me this whole time?<\/p>\n<p>There was a lot of debate, and I was very lucky to bounce ideas off with some of the top CMOs in the industry (do I put my name in it? Do I not?) And at this stage and phase in the business, I\u2019ve chosen to. I think everybody loves to be included in a project, and a project doesn\u2019t necessarily have a start and end. It\u2019s ongoing, and I love that about it. So, it\u2019s now out there and it\u2019s excited to be launched.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Well, what I love about that story is the people that are closest to us and know us best often see what we can\u2019t see for ourselves.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Goodness, this is so true.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>That\u2019s why you need to be open and listen to everyone, and just be constantly taking on board that feedback. I think it\u2019s so important. And so, you\u2019ve ended up with a great name.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. Thank you.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Now, marketing today feels a bit like the opening passage of the tale of two cities. It was the best of times, it was the worst of times. Because in many ways, as I said in the introduction, it is exciting.<\/p>\n<p>There are so many new opportunities and new things that are opening up, but at the same time, it comes with some phenomenal challenges, which I sort of touched on. But how is that impacting the senior marketers that you work with and are talking with?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Look, I think it\u2019s an incredibly complex time for everybody and for all leaders at the moment, but specifically in marketing. And I\u2019ve had a lot of conversations with senior leaders, and there\u2019s two camps of some who are like, \u201cThank goodness I\u2019m at this stage of my career, and I\u2019ve had some of the great years behind us, and we\u2019ll be coming to an end shortly\u201d and others who are like, \u201cI am geared up and ready for what\u2019s next.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And super excited about the opportunities that are ahead of us, absolutely. They\u2019re incredibly complex, but they\u2019re embracing that and saying, \u201cHow can I solve for this complexity? And how can I look and (as you said before) have a larger and wider perspective on the challenges that we are facing right now?\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Yeah, because a lot of people are not comfortable with uncertainty. And that\u2019s the thing about complexity, is that it throws up these barriers to being able to plan and have results happen the way you think.<\/p>\n<p>There are so many uncertainties built into that, and yet business for instance, love certainty. We see businesses projecting what their returns are going to be in the next quarter and the one after that, and the one after that. But it\u2019s much harder for marketers to actually have those types of projections, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think you\u2019re spot on there, and I think leaders who are really going to take on the next wave and transition that we are currently in are absolutely going to embrace complexity because it\u2019s here to stay.<\/p>\n<p>And the solutions that we\u2019ve used previously and the levers that we\u2019ve pulled are not going to meet today\u2019s complexities, and we absolutely have to lean in, and the ones who will win will embrace it and find solutions to solve for it.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Yeah, because one of the things you need in a world that\u2019s complex is flexibility. And it\u2019s really striking the balance between having a strategy that you\u2019re following and the flexibility to actually be able to react to what gets thrown up in the marketplace, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Oh, I think flexibility is one of the hottest topics at the moment, isn\u2019t it? And every scenario of life we\u2019re all looking for flexibility and we\u2019re obsessed with it, but I absolutely agree that there are a lot of challenges and how do you have the flexibility to create that strategy, and then execute in the correct way.<\/p>\n<p>But I\u2019ve also been speaking with a lot of leaders around the obsession with strategy, and do you actually have the executional and operational tools to bring those campaigns and ideas to life?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Because growing up, I lived by the sea and we used to go sailing, and I always use that as a nice metaphor for people. I go, \u201cWhen you\u2019re racing on a yacht, you know where you\u2019re headed and you want to get there first, but what you don\u2019t control is the wind.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And so, I always think objectives and strategy is my plan of how I\u2019m going to win, but I have to be constantly reacting to the shifts in the wind direction to be able to optimize my performance. And for me, that gives me this lovely distinction between having a strategy.<\/p>\n<p>You have to have some plan in place, but what you can\u2019t be is so committed to it that even when you get a knock from the wind, you just keep sticking to that direction hoping that things will change. No, no \u2013 when you get knocked, you go about, and you start sailing on the other direction. For me, I think that\u2019s been really useful.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Yeah, and you see some of the best leaders in market-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Doing that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>A hundred percent.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>There is also this incredible pressure of accountability, and in the digital world where we\u2019ve got huge amounts of data spewing out of every consumer interaction, it\u2019s become incredibly complex as well, hasn\u2019t it? Being able to work through \u2026 well, first of all, what\u2019s the data I should be looking for and what\u2019s it actually telling me?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. And I think the complexity is coming from lots of different angles of you were so right that we can get data on nearly everything now. We can get data on how people are brushing their teeth and what side they\u2019re prioritizing, although, but firmer on this side.<\/p>\n<p>So, we are absolutely faced with an onslaught of data, that marketers need to have the skills and the tools and the teams to be able to get the best outcomes from that. They need to know what data is important and how they are then utilizing that for what\u2019s next to come.<\/p>\n<p>I have heard a lot in market around you can get an obsession of data, and you can really get stuck in the weeds of it. I think everyone\u2019s for data having an influence and definitely contributing to the direction of the strategy and what people are choosing to do. But there\u2019s just so much that how do you sit through all of it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And some of it is misleading, in isolation it may say one thing, but in a broader context it says something else. It\u2019s also interesting from my perspective that there\u2019s so many different types of marketers. I\u2019ve known marketers that are economists that have ended up in marketing, or mathematicians that are in marketing, and that they\u2019re much more comfortable with being able to read data.<\/p>\n<p>Except that, only those that can also balance that with the more intuitive aspects of their thinking, are able to learn from what the data tells them, but then still make a decision. It\u2019s almost impossible to just run it from the data alone.<\/p>\n<p>But then on the other side, those marketers that are attracted to marketing because they feel it is intuitive, more the art rather than the science, who then find it really difficult on how to process data and insights from that to actually help inform them make better decisions.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. And I think marketing\u2019s a really interesting sector that there\u2019s not necessarily a linear way to get to a CMO role. When you look at our industry, they\u2019ve got so many different backgrounds that they\u2019ve come from \u2013 some from creative agencies, there\u2019s so many different areas that they\u2019re coming to that roll through with different perspectives.<\/p>\n<p>And I think it shows the ever-changing world of marketing as well and what that role looks like. And certainly, where it sits within the business and how it\u2019s seen within the industry.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I remember Mark Ritson and Gary Vaynerchuk having an argument about whether \u2026 Gary V was saying that you don\u2019t need marketing degrees, you just get in there and do it. And Mark Ritson goes, \u201cHow can you get in there and do it if you don\u2019t even understand the fundamental principles of marketing?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And coming from a science background, I fall on Mark Ritson\u2019s view. I think Gary V probably suffers from being one of those people that\u2019s a, \u201cNatural marketer, natural sales person.\u201d So, he thinks you don\u2019t need to be trained. But the thing is, how can you know when to break the rules if you don\u2019t even know what the rules are?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely, and I think we\u2019re at \u2026 there\u2019s a lot of conversation in the market at the moment around the capability gap, and what that looks like within marketing. And there\u2019s some real challenges that teams are facing at the moment.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve spoken to a number of leaders who have stepped into new roles, come into a team, and they\u2019re like, \u201cWe don\u2019t have marketing managers, we\u2019ve got product managers.\u201d Like executional roles that actually don\u2019t understand the fundamentals of marketing. So, when you\u2019re coming in and setting a new strategy and the team are incredibly executional and tactical, there\u2019s challenges within that.<\/p>\n<p>And I think they\u2019re very much coming in from a place of how do I show them what good looks like? Have they ever seen what best practice looks like. But speaking about Mark Ritson last year, he partnered with EDMA and came out and announced or launched their capability compass. And if I understand correctly, he went out to around 300 marketers and CMOs across the Australian landscape, and they were asked 10 questions.<\/p>\n<p>It was quite a simple survey, and the findings and results were alarming (Mark Ritson\u2019s language, alarming). So, to give you two very top-line examples, which he has been sharing with the industry \u2013 32% of marketers are able to name the four Ps (32%). Then it drops even further to 16%, when you look at how do you calculate return on advertising spend?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Oh no.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>So, this is where the conversation about we are forgetting the fundamentals, we don\u2019t know the fundamentals. We need to come back to the basics and be doing them well before we can move forward.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And look, I think the disconnect personally, happened (and this is showing my age or the number of years I\u2019ve been in the industry) actually in the early nineties, what I saw personally in the early nineties. We\u2019d come out of this recession of the late eighties, business had shed lots of people, particularly in middle management.<\/p>\n<p>And then as we came into the nineties and we started to get growth again, we saw in marketing departments, very senior marketers that had been promoted, the survivors of that middle area had got promoted, but then they were recruiting lots of young people. What we\u2019d lost was the middle management that have a really important role in mentoring, incidental training, passing on experience, and you saw all sorts of things.<\/p>\n<p>I was working in advertising agencies at that time, what I saw was the things that are not taught in university courses, like how to write a brief, how to get an insight, how to judge creative work, how to present \u2026 these are all things that directly impacted me at the time.<\/p>\n<p>And I could see that I was dealing with young marketers that had no one above them, that with that experience to share with them, that all they had was this senior marketer, the CMO, the marketing director as they were called, who was so busy doing what they had to do that no one was mentoring them.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And I think it\u2019s incredibly important for marketers these days to be able to work alongside what we call master marketers and learn on the job. I think some of the big globals, specifically within FMCG, that are renowned for having really vigorous training programs and structures within marketing, which is incredible. And they attract a lot of talent because of that.<\/p>\n<p>But I think everybody, no matter what size business you are in, you need to be working along someone with those really strong fundamentals and that experience of how to execute marketing and best practice.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Because the other thing that happened obviously after that was this whole rise of the digital generation and digital marketing, which was all short-term, last click attribution, a totally different way to think about marketing. In fact, it wasn\u2019t really marketing, it was advertising. It was promotions only.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Yeah, absolutely. And I think there\u2019s a conversation that\u2019s very live today in the market around, have marketers and CMO roles changed. If we look at the four Ps, it\u2019s very rare that you actually see CMOs that have a 360 view and a 360 responsibility of the four Ps now.<\/p>\n<p>Prices being handed out to finance teams and CFOs, and place has gone to distribution teams and product has gone to product development teams, and marketing and CMOs in some cases, left with promotion. And you don\u2019t have the same overview and the same levers that you can use within that.<\/p>\n<p>And certainly, even from a global perspective, not just even within Australia, you are seeing that change and the confidence and trust decreasing. And how do you still have that seat at the CMO, at the C-suite table and that relationship with the CEO when you\u2019re not responsible for all elements? But I think it even goes one step further than that. We\u2019re also now seeing the next generation of titles coming out.<\/p>\n<p>So, we\u2019ve got Chief Customer Officer, Chief Revenue Officer, Chief Growth Officer, and in some of those cases, the CMO title disappears, has been removed. We\u2019re starting to see that in Australia as well from some of the big brands.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>It diminishes the role of marketing because the role of marketing has been transformed in a way that diminishes it. When you\u2019ve got four Ps and I know people go, \u201cOh, there\u2019s eight Ps or 57,000 Ps.\u201d Now, let\u2019s just work with four because they are still fundamental, and they have transformed. Like e-commerce has completely transformed distribution, for instance.<\/p>\n<p>So, you can\u2019t say that distribution\u2019s always the same if you\u2019ve got e-commerce as part of it. Retail media is also changing promotion. So, all of these Ps have changed. But at least by having them and understanding the interaction between each of them, it gives marketing a point of importance.<\/p>\n<p>I mean, a Chief Growth Officer cannot really be responsible for the growth of the business unless they have, say overall, four things. You cannot be responsible for growth unless you have distribution, pricing, and product as well.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think this goes back to our point earlier about the complexity of this role and the sector and industry. We\u2019re also seeing \u2026 what was my point, Darren?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>That\u2019s alright.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I had a very good point just then.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ll pick it up.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Sure.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>So, we are seeing this confusion \u2013 the confusion actually also goes not just in marketing, but I think into the C-suite as well. I think CEOs are confused about what the role of their Chief Marketing Officer is.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. And I\u2019ve been reading a lot about this recently and looking at the trust scores on a global level. And we are seeing some of the numbers shift in certain areas-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Positively?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Positively.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Good, because I got sick of \u2026 there was a report came out every year that said, \u201cCEOs don\u2019t trust their CMOs.\u201d And I\u2019m like, \u201cOn what basis?\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. So, as you can appreciate, there\u2019s a number of different attributes that come into that. There\u2019s not just one simple number, but some of the numbers are starting to shift for the positive, which I think is really great.<\/p>\n<p>But it is so much more complex of that relationship with the CMO and CEO, but the CMO role and just businesses landscape is changing faster than we\u2019ve ever seen before. You look at the consumer and our viewing behaviors now, how we engage with brands and what that looks like.<\/p>\n<p>Our viewing is schizophrenic. When was the last time we used to sit down and watch a program from start to finish with no other device in our hand or around us looking for distraction?<\/p>\n<p>So, I think the world of the consumer is changing very quickly. Our expectations of brands, how we engage with them, what we expect from them. I think that consumer bullshit radars are the highest that they\u2019ve ever been, that we are in a world of abundance now. We have so much to choose from and so much noise around us that anything that is not personalized for us, junk mail.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Choice overload.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Choice overload.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And I think in the face of all that, we are seeing businesses trying to adapt. One of the ways they do that is restructuring. And there are some categories, particularly financial services, for some reason, it feels like every bank and every insurance company has their annual restructure, which always I find amusing.<\/p>\n<p>And it\u2019s not just marketing we\u2019re talking about, is they\u2019ll have a total company restructure. Trying to find the magic combination that is going to make them more adaptable to the marketplace, more efficient in the way they deliver those services, except it\u2019s incredibly disruptive and often leads to burnout.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Oh, incredibly disruptive. And I think we\u2019re seeing a lot of that at the moment. And you can feel that there\u2019s a lot of fear that it\u2019s not over yet, that there\u2019s more to come and what does the year ahead look like?<\/p>\n<p>But I think there\u2019s a few things that happen with restructures. It definitely comes down to culture, how your team are feeling, the fear that they may be feeling. There\u2019s a lot of conversation in the marketing industry at the moment. It\u2019s a soft hiring pool, and it\u2019s a soft market. So, am I just going to say stay within my current role? Let\u2019s just stay where I am?<\/p>\n<p>But I think there\u2019s also another challenge that I\u2019d argue is quite specific to marketing. Where is the best practice of what a marketing team actually looks like? And how has that changed? And how are we all learning from each other? Where\u2019s the central-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Repository of knowledge.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Repository, thank you. Repository of knowledge.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s an interesting conversation because we do get marketers come to us and to go, \u201cWhat\u2019s best practice for our marketing structure?\u201d And our point is there is no single best practice. There\u2019s a set of best practice principles that need to be applied.<\/p>\n<p>And I think this is where often mistakes get made when there is overall organizational restructure, often done by business consultants that don\u2019t necessarily understand the functional role of marketing, or don\u2019t even appreciate how the structure can actually severely impact the way marketing is seen within the organization.<\/p>\n<p>You can turn it into a service provider of business units, or you can make it a strategic partner of the business in giving advice and things. Or you can actually put it in a leadership position where it\u2019s actually driving or help to drive the direction of the business through consumer insights, it becomes the voice of the customer driving it through.<\/p>\n<p>But they don\u2019t do that. They either centralize or decentralized, and then marketers are left with this structure that fits into an overall org chart, but are not really sure how to make that work when it comes to delivering the response to a complex business problem.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely, and I think we\u2019ve seen in a number of instances where it works so well when it is centralized, because they are the voice of the customer. And they do achieve and responsible for the growth within the organization. So, I think it\u2019s definitely interesting times ahead. There\u2019s a lot of change. I think the other challenge with restructures on the horizon is marketers are going to play it safe.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Well, because they\u2019re under threat, aren\u2019t they?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>They\u2019re under threat, absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>I don\u2019t know, anyone that goes, \u201cOh, goody, there\u2019s another restructure.\u201d It\u2019s like, \u201cThere\u2019s another restructure, who are we going to lose? Or could it be me?\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. And I think the challenge with that is how are you going to get the best out of your teams, your culture, the work, when you are constantly in this flux. As you know, there\u2019s some sectors and businesses that are doing this on quite a regular basis. And then there\u2019s some that are holding strong for longer.<\/p>\n<p>But look, I think it\u2019s also a reflection of the challenges that the whole industry and market is facing, business in general as opposed to just the marketing teams. But it\u2019s always the ripping comes out for marketing as well, doesn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Well, every time there\u2019s a downturn, the first budget that seems to get cut is the marketing budget. Even though all of the data and all the research shows that when we go into slow or challenging economic times, to invest at that point actually pays off as you come out the other side.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s being shown time and time again. And this is where I think marketing leaders have a real responsibility to stand up and to be communicating that at a senior level, but not just individually. I think there\u2019s a bigger picture here as a whole sector of how do you get that conversation elevated across the industry?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And it really also depends on the maturity of an organization. When we talk about best practice in marketing, it\u2019s very different with a startup to a well-matured business in a mature category.<\/p>\n<p>Whether a brand is on the rise, it\u2019s plateaued, and you\u2019re managing the plateau, whether it\u2019s market leader or its second \u2026 I mean, again, in marketing, there\u2019s so many variables and so many things that need to be considered as part of that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. None of it as straightforward. But again, leaders who embrace the complexity I believe will win.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Do you think that\u2019s why certain types of people are attracted to marketing? When you think about your network of marketing leaders, there must be some attributes that you see repeated time and time again. I\u2019m not saying they\u2019re all the same, but there are certain skills or attributes or approaches or philosophies that they all have.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. It\u2019s interesting that you ask that. A lot of the leaders that I speak with, they\u2019re incredibly driven, incredibly passionate about what they do.<\/p>\n<p>They can definitely see the bigger picture, and they can see the role and the influential role that marketing can play, not just simply within their organization, within communities and within society, and how marketing can be a force for good and really change societal challenges that we are faced with.<\/p>\n<p>When the intersection of marketing and societal challenges that we are faced with intersect can have huge ramifications for the better. I think they\u2019re incredibly innovative. Innovation is a big one. And you can just see them light up when they get the opportunity for anything innovative and to be growing the sector, and looking for anything new.<\/p>\n<p>But I have a huge amount of respect for marketers and what they\u2019re taking on at the moment. It\u2019s a huge remit, and it\u2019s getting increasingly larger and more challenging. But also, they\u2019re expected to be across so much more. We are now expected, as we talked earlier about, they\u2019ve got to be in and across intimately with the data.<\/p>\n<p>They\u2019ve got to know the data set and what that means for the organization. They have to know their product inside and out. They have to know how the organization is making money, what that looks like. They have to be all across the finances and have that financial acumen. But then they\u2019ve got to have the eye on the horizon as well of what\u2019s coming next. But they\u2019ve got to be across societal issues. It\u2019s huge for brands these days.<\/p>\n<p>And you look at all of the numbers and stats around consumers looking to brands to have a purpose, who they are, what they stand for, what their values are, but how they\u2019re going to create change in society, and the next generation are not going to sit around and wait. They\u2019re forcing change.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I remember one of the first marketers that I worked with, after I started my business, Andrew Nowicki, who was at Cadbury. He was the CMO at Cadbury, this is well before it was merged into Mondelez and Kraft.<\/p>\n<p>But he used to carry a folder with him and in that folder, there was a sleeve for every single brand, and we\u2019re talking like 60, 80 brands. There was a sleeve, and it was updated if not daily, weekly. So that at any time, if the CFO or the CEO stopped him in the hallway and said, \u201cHow\u2019s that brand going?\u201d He\u2019d have all of the numbers, all of the activities, all the expenditure at his fingertips.<\/p>\n<p>And I remember at the time, going, \u201cThis is someone that really gets the business of marketing. And yet the work that they were producing and the innovation that they were driving in product and in the promotions meant that he also got the art of marketing. And I still think people like to take one side or the other, it\u2019s art or it\u2019s science. I think it\u2019s still both. And anyone that can-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s definitely an opportunity for both.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Yeah. When you can work across both of those comfortably, it makes you an outstanding marketer.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. You can easily see leaders who are setting themselves apart by having a deep understanding of both. And I\u2019d argue that organizations are in a space where they\u2019re demanding that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. And I know we\u2019ve talked about this before, but setting expectations. I often find that one of the things we don\u2019t see between marketers and their agencies, and rarely is it talked about between marketers and CEOs, for instance, is setting a performance expectation, I\u2019ll give you an example.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s getting a phone call from a marketer going, \u201cI need a new agency because the current one\u2019s not performing.\u201d And I go, \u201cOkay, what are they not performing against?\u201d And they go, \u201cWell, they\u2019re not giving me the creative work.\u201d \u201cWell, have you set an expectation with them of what you need or want from them?\u201d \u201cNo, I guess not.\u201d And I go, \u201cCould be a good starting point.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I also hear the same thing about the conversations between CEOs and CMOs, except in a few isolated cases. Why do you think that is? Why is it that we are not having quite frank and detailed conversations around setting expectations on performance and delivery?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think there\u2019s a few reasons for that, and I think as we can appreciate a case-by-case situation, it\u2019s unique to all businesses and leadership partnerships, but I think there\u2019s a few things. When CMOs and marketers come into roles, that is what they contractually have to deliver, that\u2019s quite clearly stipulated.<\/p>\n<p>But increasingly the expectations go far beyond what is contractually agreed within their roles. And I think it\u2019s partly some of these expectations are harder to measure. But also, the landscape is shifting faster than those are being updated as well. And there\u2019s an expectation of, aren\u2019t we just going to pick these things up? Hasn\u2019t that been \u2026 I think there\u2019s opportunity to miss between the dots being joined.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I also think it\u2019s because a lot of CEOs are not marketers, so they don\u2019t know what a marketer can do or they\u2019ve got a perception because \u2026 and I based this on, I was invited to one of those big accounting firm breakfasts with lots of businesspeople, and they were talking about sales this and sales that.<\/p>\n<p>And I said, \u201cWhat about marketing?\u201d And one of them actually said, \u201cOh, the coloring in department.\u201d And I thought, \u201cYou really have no idea.\u201d But then why should they have an idea of what marketing can do for their business?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think this is a two-sided coin of I absolutely agree with it. I don\u2019t think that CEOs do understand the full remit and the potential of what marketing can bring to an organization. And really, the levers that a marketer holds to achieve the growth and understanding the voice of the consumer.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>So, if they\u2019re given the power to do it, they have to be given the authority to be able to pull those levers.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Absolutely. But I think there\u2019s also another point that marketers and our industry, we have a responsibility to create this narrative. And for whatever reason, it has been pigeonholed as the coloring in department.<\/p>\n<p>And I spoke to a marketer a few weeks ago at an award ceremony, congratulated them on their award. Of course, they were there with their agency, brilliant work. And I said, \u201cAre you going to go and celebrate this back in the office?\u201d And they said, \u201cIt\u2019s actually a really fine line of how we manage all of this.\u201d Because when you bring an award for brilliant work based on results of what you\u2019ve achieved within the industry-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>So, an Effie Award?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>An Effie Award, it wasn\u2019t that specific award.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>But effectiveness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Within effectiveness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Because I can understand why creative awards don\u2019t necessarily resonate at a board or CEO level, but Effie Awards, you would have to say have direct to business correlation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Again, this is based on business culture as well of what that culture looks like internally. But do the rest of the organization actually care that an award was won? And I think there\u2019s a real balancing act of when you\u2019re out there being seen to be winning a lot of awards, is it actually exacerbating (not in all cases, in some cases) that you are the coloring in department.<\/p>\n<p>So, how is an industry, are we actually framing that conversation to the C-suite to say we\u2019re much more than the coloring in department. It\u2019s not just within awards either. It\u2019s within all communication that we are doing. And I believe that leaders in the industry have got a responsibility to shape this narrative, not as an individual, as a whole.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Because marketing, advertising, media are all functions of business. We only exist because there are businesses that need the services, those capabilities to actually drive demand and drive growth for those products. They don\u2019t exist.<\/p>\n<p>I love the story of saying, \u201cIf you don\u2019t believe in it, just stop doing it for 12 months and let\u2019s see where you\u2019re at.\u201d Because no one will do it. It\u2019s very easy to say, well, \u201cWhat\u2019s the marketing doing?\u201d Well, okay, if you don\u2019t think it\u2019s actually creating any value, don\u2019t do it. And even the argument that\u2019s incremental, it\u2019s still incremental. It\u2019s incremental growth to get you from a small business to a big business.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And I think that\u2019s the challenge as well. I do know some marketers who start testing things and turning things off, turning things on and off to see the result and impact from that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>As they should.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>As they should. But I also think this is (Binet-Field) The Long and Short Of It \u2013 of what is the long-term that you\u2019re then going to see if you are turning it all off, for example. But I think it\u2019s always questioned. I think there\u2019s a lot of conversation at the moment of our marketers really driving down into this performance space.<\/p>\n<p>And again, conversations need to be had at an industry level on what that looks like. We are now getting into the conversation of, well, within any one campaign, can you have performance? Can you achieve both? It\u2019s an interesting space and I think it\u2019s unique for the sectors as well that they\u2019re working in.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Yeah, of course. Absolutely. it\u2019s also interesting because you\u2019ve mentioned about awards, the rise of what people are calling the celebrity CMO. And I have a case study, it was a ISP that was a real challenger in its market, it wasn\u2019t Australia.<\/p>\n<p>And they engaged an agency, they did an amazing campaign, which got off the scale score for awareness, which translated into people buying or signing up a subscription for the ISP. It even made the television news, which had the agency and the CMO there, and virtually, the week after the campaign broke, the CMO got fired because the CEO went, \u201cWhy are you on television when I should be on television?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And so, that\u2019s an extreme version of that balancing act. Where the CMO was thinking, I\u2019m doing everything possible to make this brand famous in a very short time, except not realizing that by them being so closely associated with it, it was seen that they were making themselves famous as well, and that upset the political balance.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think it\u2019s an incredibly fine type rope that all leaders are walking at the moment, and there\u2019s nuances within every organization. And what does your culture look like internally? What\u2019s the support structures of how to \u2026 the C-suite see that and position that.<\/p>\n<p>But it\u2019s incredibly challenging for leaders to have a voice these days on the issues that matter most. And not to be seen as self-promoting, and not to be positioning themselves as \u2026 and there\u2019s definitely some reputations in industry of marketers saying, \u201cWell, some leaders promote themselves better than they are at their marketing roles.\u201d \u00a0That\u2019s all off the cuff banter, but I think it\u2019s an incredibly challenging role for marketers at the moment to navigate that. But it can be done well.<\/p>\n<p>And we have seen examples of that within industry of leaders who navigate that incredibly well of positioning themselves as a leader, being really passionate about what they do. They\u2019re really clear on what they stand for and their voice in market with also tying that back to the business and having really clear, strong business results from it.<\/p>\n<p>I think one of the biggest things, certainly B2B within our industry, is around talent. And as consumers, we\u2019re all looking beyond the logos these days, and we\u2019re looking at the leaders. And we want to know who they are, what they stand for, what their values are, what change they\u2019re committed to make. And when anyone\u2019s looking for their next role, they\u2019re absolutely looking at these leaders.<\/p>\n<p>So, what is their profile without overstepping in the case that you\u2019ve just given?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And I think what it is, is building \u2026 and you touched on it just then. It\u2019s building a reputation that is very business-focused. That anchors itself in, \u201cI\u2019m a businessperson first, with marketing capabilities. What that means is that my priorities are business, marketing, and the industry that I operate in because by improving that, I improve my ability to deliver back to business.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>It becomes a context of seeing as an equal, because virtually, everyone else sitting on the C-suite will say, \u201cI\u2019m here for the business.\u201d Well, that\u2019s fine, except the CFO is also looking at what are the accounting standards, and what\u2019s professional development look like?<\/p>\n<p>And the HR, the people-people are looking at how do we better attract and nurture talent. They\u2019re all doing the same thing. It\u2019s just the fine line from my perspective (and tell me if I\u2019m wrong) is keeping it very much anchored in the business of marketing than necessarily the what could be seen as the show the showbiz side of it.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I completely understand where you\u2019re coming from. I think it goes a step further. And leaders who create an executive brand where they are sharing, every leader, specifically CMOs are standing on a mountain of value.<\/p>\n<p>They have got a huge mountain of value, they\u2019ve got their own personal perspectives and their own personal experiences that nobody else has walked in their specific shoes. And I think they have a lot to share. And I think they have a responsibility to share as well.<\/p>\n<p>When executive brands are looked at or presented in a way where it\u2019s facing inwards and itself, and it\u2019s very much about me, again, we\u2019ve all got bullshit radars, we can sniff it from a mile away. So, I think-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>This jam factor.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think there\u2019s two different positionings of it, and it\u2019s very clear, we see it all the time. Anybody who\u2019s reading an article or a podcast or seeing someone on stage or a LinkedIn post, whatever platform it is, everyone can see it from a mile away.<\/p>\n<p>And I think it\u2019s incredibly nuanced and it takes tools and strategy to really define as a leader how you\u2019re going to show up, and how you want to give back. Absolutely, for self, because your executive brand is you, and it\u2019s how you are going to show up and what is authentic to you as a leader, but also what does that look like from a business case. Because at the extreme, you\u2019ve got that example and that won\u2019t be the only one.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>No, no, it was just the one that I was first shocked by. So, Emma, time\u2019s getting away from us. So, one of the things I wanted to touch on or give you an opportunity \u2013 because what is the sort of role that The Emma Logan Project plays?<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s obviously going to be marketers listening to this and saying, \u201cOkay, this is really interesting, I\u2019m enjoying the conversation.\u201d But what are the types of things that you\u2019re doing with marketers at the moment?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Great question. So, stepping back one or two steps, I went through a process when I wrapped up my previous role at AANA, where I got really clear on the value that I had and how I want to share that.<\/p>\n<p>And I could then very clearly identify a gap in the market that marketers are the best storytellers in business. They create cultures, they create brands, they shape perspectives and create movements. And when marketing is at its best, you\u2019ve got strong leaders behind it.<\/p>\n<p>And just because they\u2019re great at storytelling doesn\u2019t mean that they are brilliant at marketing themselves or the storytelling within themselves. And as much as some of the principles can be transferred in a similar, it\u2019s incredibly confronting to shape something for yourself rather than for a brand. And I think that\u2019s an interesting point that we have always stood behind brands.<\/p>\n<p>You\u2019ve got whatever logo or brand you work for, and we do get to stand behind that as a leader, when you come out and you are presenting yourself, there\u2019s a very thin veil. But in my terminology, I am helping marketers become more magnetic so they can make their mark.<\/p>\n<p>And what that looks like, is it\u2019s how we work together with individuals and wider teams on how we shape their executive brand. And to be really clear, an executive brand isn\u2019t how you show up on LinkedIn, it\u2019s so much wider than that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>When you just said their teams, because the best marketers from my perspective, are the ones that build great teams and the ones that enjoy the success of the team more than they even enjoy the personal success.<\/p>\n<p>I know LinkedIn can be so cynical and they go, \u201cHere\u2019s another humble brag.\u201d But it\u2019s great when I see a senior marketing leader talking about the achievements of members of their team with so much joy and pride in creating that. It\u2019s the same as great creative directors \u2013 don\u2019t need to own the idea, they just need to create the environment for their team members to achieve greatness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And when it\u2019s done authentically, you can see that it\u2019s so clear. Everyone can read it and feel it. But I think there\u2019s a big opportunity. I think marketing, as we were saying, is going through a huge transition moment at the moment. And there\u2019s a big opportunity for leaders to step up to have that voice.<\/p>\n<p>I think as consumers we are looking beyond the logo, as we were saying before, we\u2019re looking to leaders. We want that personal connection.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And authenticity.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>I think authenticity is such an interesting word because when I speak with leaders, it\u2019s like, \u201cWell, how do you want to show up authentically?\u201d And it\u2019s like, \u201cWell, I\u2019ve always shown up as part of the brand. How do I show up personally?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>We actually need to tap into that and define that. But I think it\u2019s important to also realize that we can\u2019t stand for everything. And when we do stand for everything-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>You stand for nothing.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Your audience gets very confused, what are we doing today? So, I think it\u2019s really important to define what are the things that are authentic to you, what you want to champion, how you want to make your mark.<\/p>\n<p>And marketers have got a big responsibility for shaping cultures, shaping society. We\u2019ve got a lot of intersections with really big challenges at the moment. How do we want to influence the next generation who are potentially going to come into this industry? And when you look at the global stage, there are marketers saying, does marketing have a PR problem? And they\u2019re saying-<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a big question.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a big question. And if you are coming out of university these days, and even the education sector has changed so much \u2013 are you looking at marketing as a career when marketing function is viewed as driving consumerism, and consumerism is now not seen to be sustainable. What does that look like, and how are we shaping that narrative for the next generation?<\/p>\n<p>Because it\u2019s not taking away from the fact that marketing can achieve incredible things and can drive brilliant change sometimes faster than regulation and legislation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Sometimes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma:<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Sometimes. But we\u2019ve seen that time and time again, where they really have shaped culture.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>And drive positive change.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>A hundred percent.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Well, with that uplifting note, thank you Emma Logan, and all the best with The Emma Logan Project. It\u2019s been terrific having the conversation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Emma<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Thank you, Darren. It\u2019s been brilliant.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Darren<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<p>Just a question before you go: if you chose a marketer that is the pinnacle example, who would it be?<\/p>\n<\/p><\/div>\n\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Emma Logan is the founder and chief connections officer of the Emma Logan Project, which helps marketers stop blending in and start standing out. Emma has spent the past 14 years as an insider to the upper echelons of marketing and media leadership, holding senior roles in Australia, the UK, and New Zealand.\u00a0 While there [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":187427,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[98],"tags":[11117,17475,17389,8402],"dealstore":[],"offerexpiration":[],"class_list":["post-187426","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-marketing","tag-challenges","tag-facing","tag-leaders","tag-marketing"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v26.4 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>The Challenges Facing Marketing Leaders - Som2ny Network<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/fivemor.com\/?p=187426\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"The Challenges Facing Marketing Leaders - Som2ny Network\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Emma Logan is the founder and chief connections officer of the Emma Logan Project, which helps marketers stop blending in and start standing out. 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